Just a word to JWs who may be reading this forum.

[victormr]

Another fishy story!

[martyd]

Merry Christmas Victor !

[victormr]

God’s Word tells us precisely when Jesus died, but it gives little direct indication as to when he was born. This brings to mind King Solomon’s words: “A name is better than good oil, and the day of death than the day of one’s being born.” (Ecclesiastes 7:1) It is not surprising, then, that the Bible provides many details about Jesus’ ministry and death but few details about the time of his birth.

[Linda]

Another fishy story!

LOL.  I have one for you.

There was a brother who had a beard. He did not serve as an elder or ministerial servant. He did not handle the microphones or work the literature etc. He came, he listened, sometimes commented and after the meeting was a warm and loving associate.

He had been counseled privately about his beard. He did not shave it off. Well, the big guns came out. At the next local needs talk the subject was brothers who insist on keeping their beards are doing wrong. There was only one brother in the hall who had a beard! He was publicly crucified for having a beard! The result?..many in that hall had confirmed in their minds what they already suspected; the elder body was a devil in the making.

I have other "fishy" stories if you care to hear them.

[martyd]

i agree with you victor-but i believe christmas should be a conscience matter not an organizational mandate .

[Linda]

God’s Word tells us precisely when Jesus died, but it gives little direct indication as to when he was born. This brings to mind King Solomon’s words: “A name is better than good oil, and the day of death than the day of one’s being born.” (Ecclesiastes 7:1) It is not surprising, then, that the Bible provides many details about Jesus’ ministry and death but few details about the time of his birth.

I agree.

[proverbs3-5]

i remember a jw  sister who started partaking and was immeadatly excluded from gatherings and was hounded by the elders until she finally disassociated herself.this was 10 years ago-but i guess the organizational procedual directive has changed since then as we see their numbers rising.maybe they will unlock the vault and bring back the old great company teaching.one thing is certain-many of us former jws are strenghthened not to return as we watch the wts continually flounder with their doctrine.

I've witnessed similar happenings in my local area. A sister once moved into our congregation because she was getting so much flak from her old congregation of professing a heavenly calling. The brothers in our congregation tried to be more understanding but continued to counsel her to study certain publications to be sure. One thing my father has always said that sort of makes sense is that 'if you're unsure then you're probably not of the anointed.' He has always felt that if you're of the anointed then you will know it. He has always felt that if someone thinks they are then they probably are not. Of course that doesn't mean anything, just his perception. This was the counsel he gave to this sister. She's no longer in our congregation having moved to another part of the country, but last I heard she was still partaking.

Hey Victor, I used to be just like you! Dismissing experiences like the ones I share until I woke up one day and realized that I HAD THEM. I then started to question these stories and ask myself why we always kept these sort of things quiet? Of course...we keep these subjects taboo in order to preserve the unity of the organization and prevent stumbling others. Then I realized that I, myself, had been stumbled and no longer felt it was right to keep these subjects quiet. From your activities here on the forum I've formed an opinion of you. You are a rank-and-file publisher, you probably have no idea how a JW's conduct is supposed to be carried out according to the OD book (have you ever read the OD book in its entirety? Most JW's have not, most can't even remember what it is!), you probably come from a small congregation where hardly any controversies arise (if at all) and so you experience the entire organization through this one little congregation where everything is sweet and rosie. I have been involved with a total of 13 congregations in my life of service to the Organization. Spread out all across the country and two congregations in a foreign country. Every congregation has their own set of problems that usually stem from a few elders who see things their way. There is a neighboring congregation in my local area where they have plenty of capable brothers, yet the elders' and ministerial servants' wives work in the literature and magazine departments, and carry microphones, and lead the group in field service, even offering opening and closing prayers. Their excuse is that the brothers in their congregation don't get enough time in field service. This is a congregation of 75 or more! Many have moved into our congregation and are right away put to work in areas that they couldn't be used in the other congregation, and our congregation requires you at least make the national average of field service hours before you can be used! Many of us in the surrounding congregations are bewildered at how they seem to pull the wool over the CO's eyes when he comes to visit. Jehovah's organization?
Anyhow, I put your intelligence at around 12-16 years old (note I am not saying you are 12-16 years old) since you understand Jehovah to be a comic book hero and continue to use "smileys." And you continue to participate in this forum, showing a flagrant disregard for the instructions of the Society (thats called "loose conduct" by the way, you can be DF'd for it.) And since you seemingly know everything and you're not hear to learn, ask questions, study, or grow in your faith, then you obviously must have what I call no life.

I suggest you start scouring other Kingdom Halls, Assemblies, and Conventions for a mate. Its ok, go trolling for sisters! Once you find one that you can trick into dating you, go on a few [chaperoned] dates and get married, get a job, have kids....you know: a life.

Cheers.

[proverbs3-5]

Another fishy story!

LOL.  I have one for you.

There was a brother who had a beard. He did not serve as an elder or ministerial servant. He did not handle the microphones or work the literature etc. He came, he listened, sometimes commented and after the meeting was a warm and loving associate.

He had been counseled privately about his beard. He did not shave it off. Well, the big guns came out. At the next local needs talk the subject was brothers who insist on keeping their beards are doing wrong. There was only one brother in the hall who had a beard! He was publicly crucified for having a beard! The result?..many in that hall had confirmed in their minds what they already suspected; the elder body was a devil in the making.

I have other "fishy" stories if you care to hear them.

Oh my goodness...Linda, I think we may know each other!

[Linda]

LOL, not likely but all things are possible! 

[proverbs3-5]

I was in a congregation where that happened. That story sounds hauntingly familiar! I've always felt that it was wrong to judge people based on those sort of things. We should be groomed and dignified but it always bothered me that some fellow believers (elders included) were concerned that I kept my hair just a tad long in relation to other brothers, who always went for the "theocratic haircut", short, tapered, no side-burns. Almost felt like the military. And it bothered me when people would give me counsel about 'not letting my hair grow any longer or I couldn't be used in the congregation anymore' when most of their sons were getting spiked and sloppy haircuts, although their length conformed. And then their daughters were wearing miniskirts and tight-fitting blouses...and while pioneering. A CO once counseled a pioneer sister at meeting for field service 'to go home and put on a longer skirt before sharing in the day's activities.' Him and his wife did this privately and lovingly. This same sister was one of those who was all about appearances...she had quite a reputation among the younger people. That was the other thing that always amazed me...elders' kids could away with murder. I never did because I sincerely loved Jehovah and didn't want to abuse my parents' trust, but all of my friends could sure pull the wool over their eyes. Those kids were smoking and drinking and having wild parties. A situation came up where they all got caught and it was found that a daughter of an elder in another congregation (a girl I knew since childhood) was having sex with two other teenage brothers. I knew about this because this girl was my sister's niece by marriage. It was later found that all of the kids were pretty much involved in this in one form or another, or at least knew about it. Anyway, she got away with it because her father found some old information in a Watchtower that allowed them to have her baptism annulled. What the? First time I had ever witnessed something like that. Man...the more I relate these stories, I just can't figure out what kept in there so long...

[Linda]

Proverbs3-5,

If you were on the Governing Body what would you do to help the friends avoid some of the pitfalls you just described?

[humbleservant]

God’s Word tells us precisely when Jesus died, but it gives little direct indication as to when he was born. This brings to mind King Solomon’s words: “A name is better than good oil, and the day of death than the day of one’s being born.” (Ecclesiastes 7:1) It is not surprising, then, that the Bible provides many details about Jesus’ ministry and death but few details about the time of his birth.

This is the difference with an organization that is based on mens thoughts, they are unable to be fully led by the Holy Spirit. All we need to do is get the understanding how YHWH's dealings with His Holy Nation proceeded, we can then do the math.

There are only "two" main Holy times/periods on the Jewish calendar, Pesach/Passover & Yom Kippur/Day of Atonement, with a lesser time that is a also kept, Chanukah/Hanukah.
If we put all these together, we can see YHWH's outworkings, without any difficulty at all.

1)Chanukah = conception
2)Yom Kippur = Birth
3)Pesach = Death

It all adds up when we do the math. It must also be borne in mind that in the "Jewish calendar", that these dates move each year due to the 29/30 day calendar employed by Israel, as they need to add an extra 30 day month at regular intervals to balance the 360 day calendar with the seasons.

Just some thoughts on the matter.

[victormr]

This is the difference with an organization that is based on mens thoughts, they are unable to be fully led by the Holy Spirit. All we need to do is get the understanding how YHWH's dealings with His Holy Nation proceeded, we can then do the math.

There are only "two" main Holy times/periods on the Jewish calendar, Pesach/Passover & Yom Kippur/Day of Atonement, with a lesser time that is a also kept, Chanukah/Hanukah.
If we put all these together, we can see YHWH's outworkings, without any difficulty at all.

1)Chanukah = conception
2)Yom Kippur = Birth
3)Pesach = Death

It all adds up when we do the math. It must also be borne in mind that in the "Jewish calendar", that these dates move each year due to the 29/30 day calendar employed by Israel, as they need to add an extra 30 day month at regular intervals to balance the 360 day calendar with the seasons.

Just some thoughts on the matter.


[/quote]

??

[humbleservant]

Vic, you stated;

Quote,
"God’s Word tells us precisely when Jesus died, but it gives little direct indication as to when he was born."

So I answered when He was born, at the time of Yom Kippur/Day of Atonement, simple.

Y'shua, was to be the "sin atoning sacrifice" for mankind, being born on or about the "day of atonement", & being sacrificed on the "passover", this makes it very clear that these dates were given by YHWH with the complete picture of salvation/restitution for mankind in mind. When we start to think in "Jewish terms", the scriptures begin to take on a whole new meaning.

[RR]

I remember the CO tried to get me to shave my mustache, and informed the PO to inform the brothers they must be clean shaven or lose their privileges. I looked at him and asked him to show me from the Bible where I can't have a mustache. I never shaved it off.

RR